Diskussion:Bodhipakkhiyadhamma

Kontext

Vielen Dank für die Mühe, die Ihr Euch mit der Auflistung für die Erleuchtungsregeln gemacht habt! Sicher werden die einzelnen Aspekte nach und nach auch mit Inhalt gefüllt. Was aber noch fehlt ist eine Beschreibung des Kontextes in dem diese Regeln aufgestellt wurden. Ich wüßte gerne, in welcher Tradition die Regeln stehen und was Bodhipakkhiyadhamma eigentlich bedeutet. Manuel Krüger-Krusche

Theravada --BambooBeast 21:20, 7. Jun. 2007 (CEST)

Die Vier Rechten Anstrengungen

I am sorry that I do not speak German (despite my last name being "Rosenfeld"). I hope my use of English (my native language) here does not offend anyone. If it does, I deeply apologize.

I am grateful to the editors of this article because, while I do not know German, I do know some Pali and I used this article to develop the English WP version of this article at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhipakkhiyadhamma. I wanted to bring to your attention though that I think I have discovered that the Pali words associated with the section on "Die Vier Rechten Anstrengungen" is incorrect. It appears to confuse the "Four Right Exertions" (cattārimāni sammappadhānāni) with the "Four Exertions" (cattārimāni padhānāni). See the English WP article at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Right_Exertions.

If you think I am in error or would like to discuss this further with me, please either send me a note at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Larry_Rosenfeld or add a note to the talk page of one of the aforementioned articles. (Perhaps you could suggest a good free Web-based German-to-English translation tool as well!) Mahametta, 24.136.229.74[1] 13:52, 1. Jun. 2007 (CEST) (talk)

I cant see a significant difference between those two terms - they are very strong linked to each other. E.g. the sake of the non-arising [anuppādāya] of evil, unskillful qualities that have not yet arisen is in my understanding a differnent explanation to Restraint (saṃvara padhāna) of the senses. The (german) sources I use make no specific difference between Four Right Exertions and Four Exertions. Anyway - I changed the german text - so i hope it not confusing any more. --BambooBeast 22:05, 7. Jun. 2007 (CEST)

Hi BambooBeast! Again, please accept my apologies for my knowing only English & please accept my applause and gratitude for your English fluency.

I agree that there is a great deal of overlap in the general meaning of the fourfold Right Exertions and fourfold Exertions; however, there are some significant differences:

1. The Pali words are different. Thus, for instance, in the wording associated with the Four Right Exertions, the Pali words samvara and bhavana are not found.
2. Some specifics are significantly different. For instance, the third Right Exertion has to do with ripening skillful qualities (which, according to the commentaries, are non-greed, non-hate and non-delusion) while the third Exertion is cultivation of the seven bojjhangas (e.g., mindfulness, investigation of dhamma, energy, joy, tranquility, concentration and equanimity). More strikingly, the fourth Exertion explicitly and memorably refers to concentrating on corpses in various states of decay while the fourth Right Exertion refers to maintaining and increasing skillful states (again, according to the commentaries, non-greed, non-hate, non-delusion).

I think this is important for two reasons: (1) this article uses Pali words associated with the Four Exertions to describe the Four Right Exertions; and, moreover, (2) from a practice standpoint, trying to practice these two different formulations (Four Right Exertions vs. Four Exertions) can be very different (e.g., the Fourth Right Exertion suggests a mindfulness practice while the Fourth Exertion explicitly identifies a concentration practice, although the two of course are generally developed in tandem).

If you think what I write is unimportant, I can respect that. Regardless, thank you so much for your thoughtfulness, kindness and excellence in developing WP Buddhism articles. With metta, 24.136.229.74 07:21, 8. Jun. 2007 (CEST) (talk)

Thank you for the detailed explanation. Now I can see the difference and the need to use to correct terms. --BambooBeast 09:50, 8. Jun. 2007 (CEST)

Well done! Bravo! Sadhu, sadhu, sadhu! I bow to your wise efforts for the benefit of all beings. 24.136.229.74 19:49, 8. Jun. 2007 (CEST)